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 To Light, and Heavy Bow gun users

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Valin000
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PostSubject: To Light, and Heavy Bow gun users   Sat Feb 21, 2015 9:36 pm

I decided to begin learning the ways of the bow guns, (figured that way i can use more then 1 weapon with my gunner sets). Can someone who is intermediate/advanced with bow guns give me any tips/advice on the weapons.
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Rjthakid
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PostSubject: Re: To Light, and Heavy Bow gun users   Fri Mar 20, 2015 12:39 am

I consider myself intermediate with HBG so I'll offer a few tips on that weapon.

1) Critical distance
One of the easiest ways to kill your damage output is to be either too close or too far from your target.  In previous games finding the right distance was a bit harder. Now there is a slight screen shake to indicate that you're the appropriate distance away from the monster.  I strongly suggest you do some easy hunts with a HBG to get a feel for the critical distance of each shot type (The Pierce critical distance is a bit farther than the Normal one).

2) Element vs Raw
In short, you want to be using Raw shots with a HBG as much as possible.  Fact is, LBGs are drastically better at dealing elemental damage.  HBGs excel at dealing raw damage.  Personally the only time I use element with a HBG is when my raw shots are exhausted.

3) Offensive Skills
Shot-type Up is your friend.  If you're using a particular HBG for Normal shots, NormalUp makes sense.  Same with Pierce shots.  Weakness Exploit is an excellent skill as well.  The standard offensive skills all work well with HBG, but Shot-type Up and Weakness Exploit are particularly good.

4) Defensive Skills
Two skills I always use are Evade Extender and Evasion +3.  Evasion +2 would suffice in most situations, but as someone who does a lot of 140 Guild Quests not getting hit is vital.  Evade Distance is almost a necessity for me personally as it gives the HBG some much needed mobility.  Eat Grains & Drink for Felyne Moxie.  As a gunner it will save your butt.

5) Practice
Before you fight any monster online with a HBG, I recommend you first go to the Elder Hall OFFline and take it on.  Not to kill it though.  To get a feel for it.  Evade around it.  Stay ALIVE.  Fight it, but killing it is not necessary.  If you cart twice, abandon and redo.  Once you feel like you're comfortable and you can go extended periods without getting hit, go for it online.

This is not something I do with Blade weapons because...well I generally have 800 defense on those sets.  Unless it's a 140 GQ, nothing is one shotting me.  But gunning is different.  You have to be on point and comfortable out there or you'll spend the whole fight healing...or carting.

6) Siege Mode and Limiter removal
Siege Mode, or Crouch Firing, allows Heavy Bowguns to fire a large amount of ammo without reloading.  The downside is that it takes a second or two to get into and out of Siege Mode.  

Removing the limiter on an HBG significantly raises it's attack and raises the magazine size on select ammo types...but it also REMOVES the ability to use Siege Mode.  

Personally I find it more beneficial to remove the limiter.  Siege Mode can do an obscene amount of damage in a short time, but there just aren't enough safe opportunities to go into Siege Mode, whereas the damage increase from Limiter Removal is very beneficial.  To each their own though.

7) Tactics and Approach

The strength of the HBG is that it can do CONSTANT high DPS.  A monster may do an attack that hits all Blademasters standing around him (Gravios with his Gas and Sleep for example) while you keep sending it a steady diet of Pierce lvl 3 shots.  But it's a gunner weapon, which means that you must be careful.

Getting greedy probably causes 90% of Monster Hunter deaths.  If a monster has a charge attack and it begins to turn towards you, immediately begin to roll around it.  Don't wait till he's facing you and DEFINITELY don't wait till he begins his charge.  Not only will this keep you from taking damage, but you'll be in a safe position sooner.  Speaking of "Safe Position"...

Learn every Monster's Safe Place.  You never want to be in range of Teo's Fire Orb (The ball he creates about 4 rolls in front of his face).  You also don't want to be so close that you're in range of his Rage Mode Flare.  And you never want to be behind him as he can cause explosions there.  That leaves mid range to his side.  That's his safe place.  Find every monsters safe place and fire away.  The safe place is different when gunning.



Best of luck out there.
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PostSubject: Re: To Light, and Heavy Bow gun users   Sat Mar 21, 2015 1:33 am

I've somehow never seen all these tips mentioned at one time, only ever a combination of them all. Being I dropped HH, I might try picking up HBG if my fund income picks back up. I've said this a ton already, but these tips together will much improve my HBG game. (went from 200kish to under 100k just from making 4 weapons)

I'll be coming back to this topic for sure. 4 seems like a really good time to get into ranged weaponry. Looking at you Garuga.

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PostSubject: Re: To Light, and Heavy Bow gun users   Mon Apr 20, 2015 1:52 pm

I've soloed to G2 with LBG, but I am a very unconventional LBG user. I don't think I have fired any elemetnal shots at all in 4U. The conventional wisdom is that you want HBG for raw and LBG for element and status, and since LBG excels at status it is seen as a "support" weapon. Kinda odd, my feeling is that LBG is a much more viable solo weapon on account of the increased mobility and faster sheathing time, but YMMV. Anyways, here is the raw LBG take:

As mentioned by Rjthakid, critical distance is vital. Screen shake is a giveaway for Normal and Pierce shots - for Pellet, you need to watch the little explosions. At critical distance you'll get all of your hits, too close or too far and you won't. Note that you may end up getting Pellet hits on a distant part of the monster if you are too close and the monster is big enough. Sometimes these are hard to see. But what it means is that you can still pepper a monster's head when shooting it from behind - if you are close enough.

Pierce is the go-to shot type. This is the most damaging raw shot. There are some cases where Pellet or Normal will outperform, but they are the exceptions and not the general case. Pellet still works wonders on Zinogre and is good against Dromes. It's fantastic at clearing minions. But it just does not have the damage potential of Pierce. Also, Pellet lv2 and lv3 share a combine component so you're limited to 50 Wyvern Fangs for both shots.

Limiter Removal on an LBG disables Rapid Fire, backhop, and sidestepping. BUT it gives you "Load All Ammo" which allows you to load every shot type your gun is capable of (and you have ammunition for) at once. It takes a couple seconds to do but I can usually squeeze one in between non-raged, non-combo monster attacks. More importantly, it allows you to keep ammo loaded when switching shot types. Just finished a successful mount or got off a para with your last shot? Go straight to Pierce, how ever many levels of it you can run through while the monster is incapacitated.

So how does no Rapid Fire LBG actually play? Personally, I have two modes that abuse Load All - the full aggro version which involves reloading my main shot type normally (usually Pierce lv1 or Pellet lv3) and then dumping the extra raw damage on staggers and trips. The other option is when I'm dealing with a monster I need to be more careful about. Here I will unload all of my ammo, zone out to Reload All, and then repeat.

With Limiter on, you're generally using your Rapid Fire shots. Rapid Fire Pierce and Pellet have always been marginal, and the recoil associated with them make it hard to use for very little benefit. Rapid Fire Normal lv2 is great, but keep in mind that it is probably not making you do damage faster. Rapid Fire is an ammunition conservation skill - a three round volley does about the same damage as two single shots and takes about the same time - but only uses one bullet. The reason to keep the Limiter on is for element and status shots (and CRAGCRAGCRAGCRAG). Previous MH's, elemental shots had lass damage penalty per hit in Rapid Fire, plus ammunition for elemental shots is more limited than for raw. Status and explosive shots are even more limited in ammo and the amount of status or explosive damage inflicted per hit is unchanged in rapid fire. So a two round volley of Sleep lv2 will deal twice as much Sleep as a single shot.

Silencer vs Long Barrel - Silencer is a quick and cheap way of getting the equivalent of Recoil Down +1. If you don't need Recoil Down, you can Long Barrel for a small attack power boost. Recoil does not affect rapid fired shots - those have fixed recoil. Guns with Average Recoil can fire all levels of Normal, Pellet lv 1 and 2, and Pierce lv 1 without recoil. The Silencer enables all raw shots to be fired without recoil.

Special LBG's.
God's Archipelago. The Michael Bay gun - also the most commonly used speedrun Stat gun. It loads Sleep and Para and every level of explosive shot. With the Limiter off this gives you access to easy paralysis, ridiculously crazy explosive burst damage, and crag KOs without stopping to reload. With the Limiter on (probably solo play) you get Rapid Fire on Crag lv2 and Clust lv1, which is tasty damage indeed.

Reggie LBG. But it has High Recoil and Slow Reload! Doesn't matter, you're only going to be using the rapid fired shots (Normal lv2 and Slicing) so Recoil does not matter. But it only loads a tiny amount of Normal lv2! True, but you won't be reloading because of the special trick of the Reggie LBG. Every time you evade with the gun out, it reloads one round of whatever active ammo type you have. Two sidesteps reloads two Normal lv2 volleys. It's very different from any other LBG.

This was kind of a weird response and only covers what I was thinking of at the moment. If there's any questions left, I'd be glad to answer any questions about raw LBG or just LBG in general.
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